Twisted Anthroposophy
From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Thu Jan 22, 2004 2:30 pm
Subject: Twisted Anthroposophy
At 14:06 22.01.2004, Diana wrote:
Tarjei, I gotta drop the arguments about
science, just lack of time.
As far as I'm concerned, the arguments against
Steiner's take on science, not only when the topics may be legitimately
controversial, but also when they're based upon falsehood, are
far less important than the attacks launched against his personal
moral character. You may believe that Sharon "knows her
stuff," but she paints a portrait Rudolf Steiner that is
utterly false. In Sharon's depiction of Steiner's anthroposophy,
there is no room for a Christ-impulse that brings out the very
best in people and enhances humanity's noblest inclinations.
In her world of "anthroposophy", there is black magic,
sinister rituals, dark conspiracies and an evil grand master
who made a sinister plot to kidnap the children of unsuspecting
Waldorf parents, destroy them psychologically, and to create
a future master race of human robots who have not developed any
self-dependent 'I' through a philosophy of freedom, but who have
become the mindless puppets of Rudolf Steiner's "hidden
agenda."
Like I pointed out in my previous post, this
occult suspense drama of Sharon (that may read like a Stephen
King novel) feels like a blast from the past when we read Christina
Stoddard alias "Inquire Within." And for that reason,
I'll try to squeeze in the time to quote the entire ninth chapter
from her book, "Trail of the Serpent," which is dedicated
to the topic Rudolf Steiner and Anthroposophy in a vein not dissimilar
to that of PLANS.
No doubt we mean different things when
we say we are "really interested in anthroposophy,"
but I am honest in my claim and not trying to say anything cynical
or coded by that. I assure you my interest in anthroposophy is
genuine.
In that case, I'm at a loss to understand
how come you seem to have such a twisted grasp of it.
It took MONTHS – no – YEARS for
me to begin to accept that the beautiful dream was just that,
and that the problems really were systematic and could not be
understood without reference to the underlying belief system,
and the culture that comes out of it. The stories from too many
schools were too similar.
In other words, you don't like the anthroposophical
belief system and culture. That would make your professed interest
in the subject inspired by antipathy and your purpose in spending
hours and days and weeks and months and years learning more about
it, to persuade others to abhor it too. Am I right?
So, of course when I read it now I have
a quite different perspective than when I started, but I truly
cannot be accused of not having studied anthroposophy seriously
and sympathetically, and attempted to "do the work"
Again, I don't understand how you can turn
it upside down if you have studied it seriously and sympathetically,
and attempted to "do the work"
I am usually trying not to laugh on the
critics list, when anthroposophists condescend to me that I obviously
know very little about anthroposophy or Waldorf schools. I am
wrong, they say, to imagine that anthroposophy explains what
happens in Waldorf classrooms. Tell that to the teachers I worked
with.
If you want me (or someone else on this list)
to tell something to teachers you have worked with, invite them
to Anthroposophy Tomorrow.
In my observation the many "New Age"
religions are not much of an improvement over the hellfire and
brimstone I was raised with.
I have a comment about that further below
in this post.
It is also quite different to do it temporarily
for an obvious reason like breaking your thumb – rather
than, as a small child, to have this painful and confusing thing
forced on you for no apparent reason.
If you move to England and like to get around
by car, you may have to adjust permanently to operating a stick
shift with your left hand when negotiating traffic and gassing
up with your left foot. There are plenty of right-handed British
motorists who don't say that this has damaged or hurt them in
any way.
Steiner described future spiritual evolution,
corresponding to the Apocalypse of St. John, when humanity will
be divided in two groups: Those who accept the Christ Impulse
and those who reject it.
Ayyyyiiiiiiiiiieeeee. Once again, that's
how you get me to run for the hills, Tarjei, dividing humanity
into those who accept Christ and those who don't, no thank you,
been there and done that. What a stupid threat it is, why do
religious people think it is progress to divide humanity into
camps this way, it is very primitive thinking if you ask me.
Hey, ask me again next lifetime.
What seems to give you the creeps and make
you run for the hills in this case is not Anthroposophy alone,
but almost every variety of Christianity. The difference between
"Old Age" Christianity and the New Age angle you find
in Anthroposophy is that in the latter, there is fairness and
justice. Your eternal destiny is not determined by your conduct
and choices in one life only. You're not only given a "second
chance," but hundreds and perhaps thousands of chances.
And what you become is not determined by any set of beliefs,
but by your moral evolution as a complete human being. If this
is more creepy to you than the old-fashioned hellfire-and-brimstone
fundamentalism where people are hurled into an eternal lake of
fire because they hold the wrong beliefs, I don't understand
your logic.
Cheers,
Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/
...................................................................................................................................
From: winters_diana
Date: Sat Jan 24, 2004 9:02 pm
Subject: Re: Twisted Anthroposophy
Hi guys, whew, so much to reply to. And it's
hard for me, since I have to wait for Peter Staudenmaier to tell
me what to say :)
Tarjei:
In Sharon's <snip>. . . anthroposophy, there
is black magic,
You read Sharon with "antipathy"
I think Tarjei. Sharon says clearly anthroposophy is white magic.
But Sharon is tolerant of all beliefs, and not really any more
distressed by "black" than by "white" magic.
I'd agree with this position. I think you're
the one worked up about things that go bump in the night :) What's
the big deal with black magic? I've known Satanists who seemed
like nice people to me. Is there something even spookier than
Satanism? I am teasing you a bit, I think you are the one interested
in "occult suspense dramas," I think you do believe
in "black magic." Anyway speaking of paganism, pagans
often feel Waldorf is too Christian.
My friend looks over my shoulder and says
"Satanists are better than telemarketers."
My first few weeks in the Waldorf school,
I remember noticing (and setting aside my annoyance) that parents
were not told clearly how Christian the school was. I didn't
know too much of Steiner yet, but I noticed that in the song
the kindergarten children sing,
"Waken, sleeping butterfly,
burst your narrow prison,
Spread your golden wings and fly,
For the sun is risen"
the last line could also be heard, "The
Son is risen," and I thought that was a clever but rather
unfair way (sung right before Easter) to be proselytizing Christianity
to the tiny tots without the parents' full understanding. I had
a lot to learn yet about the symbol of the butterfly and the
sun in anthroposophy! They may as well have been hoping parents
would hear "Son" and not "sun"!
sinister rituals,
No, anthroposophy's rituals are not "sinister,"
they're quite lovely. I don't recall Sharon describing sinister
rituals.
I spent a lot of time in Waldorf classrooms
and I saw no sinister rituals.
dark conspiracies
I don't know about any dark conspiracies,
and if Sharon knows secrets about dark conspiracies, she's keeping
them from me :) My angle is similar to Sharon's which is mainly
that Waldorf schools should be open about their esoteric base.
I would say there is more interest here in
conspiracies than among Waldorf critics. I do believe
the pictures that little rover on Mars is sending back are real.
:)
and an evil grand master who made a sinister
plot to kidnap the children of unsuspecting Waldorf parents,
I thought we cleared this one up. They don't
kidnap anyone, and have never been accused of such to my knowledge.
destroy them psychologically, and to create
a future master race of human robots who have not developed any
self-dependent 'I' through a philosophy of freedom, but who have
become the mindless puppets of Rudolf Steiner's "hidden
agenda."
Whatever you say, Tarjei, you've spun your
own tales now. The "hidden agenda" Sharon refers to
refers to Waldorf education, I believe, and obviously it is hidden
from many parents that anthroposophy is the agenda. Hey, wait
a minute - doesn't "hidden" mean "occult"
which is the same thing as spiritual? So what's the problem with
Waldorf having a hidden agenda yes?
In other words, you don't like the anthroposophical
belief system and culture. That would make your professed interest
in the subject inspired by antipathy and your purpose in spending
hours and days and weeks and months and years learning more about
it, to persuade others to abhor it too. Am I right?
I doubt I have ever persuaded anyone to abhor
anthroposophy, or could persuade anyone to if I tried.
No – I know you don't understand this
(you guys seem stuck in this sympathy/antipathy thing), but my
interest is genuine.
What seems to give you the creeps and make
you run for the hills in this case is not Anthroposophy alone,
but almost every variety of Christianity.
That's right, it wasn't a specific criticism
of anthroposophy. You were quoting the Bible to me, something
about lining people up and asking if they accept Christ, and
I've had that stuff quoted to me quite a bit.
The difference between "Old Age"
Christianity and the New Age angle you find in Anthroposophy
is that in the latter, there is fairness and justice. Your eternal
destiny is not determined by your conduct and choices in one
life only. You're not only given a "second chance,"
but hundreds and perhaps thousands of chances.
<sigh> It's gonna get too deep for me
here, I honestly am just out of time and energy for this and
am trying to leave :) My view is that karma is not justice, but
a cynical admission that there is no justice. I mean, it only
works if you believe you have many lifetimes ahead!
Please don't get me wrong. I have nothing
against reincarnation. I like the idea, personally. There is
a sense in which I consider it true – but metaphorically,
and not the way you guys mean it or Steiner meant it. If it turns
out to be literally true, and I can come back, wonderful! I like
it here and would love to come back - to this life, that is;
not "anthroposophy_tomorrow," though you all have been
very hospitable as well, in your own way :)
Diana
...................................................................................................................................
From: holderlin66
Date: Sat Jan 24, 2004 10:24 pm
Subject: Re: Twisted Anthroposophy/boo-hoo
--- In [email protected],
winters_diana wrote:
Hi guys, whew, so much to reply to. And
it's hard for me, since I have to wait for Peter Staudenmaier
to tell me what to say :)
I'd agree with this position. I think you're the one worked up
about things that go bump in the night :) What's the big deal
with black magic? I've known Satanists who seemed like nice people
to me. Is there something even spookier than Satanism? I am teasing
you a bit, I think you are the one interested in "occult
suspense dramas," I think you do believe in "black
magic." Anyway speaking of paganism, pagans often feel Waldorf
is too Christian.
My friend looks over my shoulder and says "Satanists are
better than telemarketers."
Bradford comments;
Now character assassination, Ahriman's army
of puppets, tearing down spiritual science or fighting to see
through the sham of the Bush Administration; fighting to keep
the infection of anti-Spiritual Science gangs in brown shirts
with P.S. written on them from marching in goose step with Rush
Limbaugh towards the goal of hijacking opinion and reality into
the bosom of Ahriman, next to the heart of Rupert Murdoch...
has failed and we hang our heads in shame that we ever lumped
you together with such hyenas. We never meant to accuse any of
you of supporting the Christian Right or the Christian totally
DUMB AND DUMBER. I know you only want the best for us and I think
this letter of apology says it all. I hope you take it, exactly
the way it was meant. You certainly don't - couldn't - wouldn't
- have the ugly malice of Racism and subversive accusations against
Steiner, with his immense character flaws, at the heart of your
arguments. I think all of us here recognize your good intentions.
I just want to say that we are humbled in the presence of such
integrity and honesty and the wide spread Michael School offers
this confession of our guilt and our deep admission that your
Cult is much wiser than our Cult.
We See That Now
A heartfelt -- no -- abject -- no -- craven apology to the right
from the left for our campaign of hate, anger and malice against
God's own president.
By Tony Hendra
Issue Date: 2.1.04
We confess. It's all true.
Everything you say. We trafficked in hate. We did it in anger.
Just as you said, Mr. Kristol, Mr. Krauthammer, Mr. Brooks: We
poisoned the airwaves and befouled the sheets of our nation's
most august publications. We attacked a sitting president, impugned
his integrity, smeared his family, invaded his privacy, tried
desperately to drag him down to our own filthy, rock-bottom,
sewer-dwelling level. There is no parallel between your measured
criticism of Bill Clinton and our vile attacks on George W. Bush.
Bill Clinton deserved everything thrown at him because a corrupt
and evil man who gains the White House by underhanded means should
be attacked with every weapon at the disposal of a free press.
And yes, it's true, just as your more sagacious radio hosts have
maintained: Hillary Clinton does owe her success to the practice
of witchcraft. And no, it's not true that ridiculing Chelsea
at the most vulnerable stage in her development was the media
equivalent of child molestation. Chelsea Clinton was fair game
because she is the spawn of Satan. Scurrilous of us to suggest
that the tirelessly moderate and civil proponent of these and
so many other truths, Robert Bartley, now resides in the circle
of hell reserved for hate-mongers and bigots! Mr. Bartley dwells
in the bosom of his Republican creator. We see that now.
George W. Bush cannot be,
as we've screamed till we're blue in the face, the cretinous
finger puppet of an incalculably cynical and malevolent cabal
and a ruthless neo-Confederate, bent on creating a plutocratic
ruling class at home and a rapacious corporate imperium abroad.
He's one or the other. We cannot have it both ways. We see that
now.
Similarly, we can hardly denigrate
Rupert Murdoch and his "gutter press" while at the
same time carping that without him the right would be a marginalized
mob of obscurantist paranoids kept on life support by retrograde
trust-fund nut jobs. Mr. Murdoch is a great populist. Lowest-common-denominator
programming is an honorable tradition in both the United States
and the United Kingdom. Taking such programming to China, where
he is equally solicitous of a proto superpower whose interests
are frequently inimical to ours, does not mean that Mr. Murdoch
is giving aid and comfort to the enemy, or that NewsCorp's money
is somehow "tainted." It's despicable of us to suggest
that all those hardworking journalists -- from Bill O'Reilly
to William Kristol -- who take his supposedly dirty money are
likewise tainted! We see that now.
What demon put into our so-called
minds the idea that the ghastly tragedy of that bright morning
in September 2001 might have been prevented because the Bush
administration had received warnings for a month that some sort
of attack might be coming? And that the president and his advisers
had ignored that intelligence and then made use of the tragedy
to seize the draconian emergency powers they craved and get the
economy back onto a perpetual-war footing? How could we even
entertain such thoughts? What venom flowed through our hate-infarcted
hearts?
We're sorry for our endless
ranting about oil being the lifeblood of the Bush family circle,
and The Carlyle Group existing as nothing more than a gigantic
corporate kickback to its members for faithful service while
in office, and the Bush team comprising the selfsame men who
supported Saddam Hussein to the hilt while he was committing
most of his genocidal atrocities and therefore making them his
guilty accomplices. These are vicious, hateful untruths. We see
that now.
The First Amendment does not
give us the right to screech that young Americans are dying in
Iraq so that George W. Bush can get himself legitimately elected
president. It's a bald-faced lie that his bald-faced lies about
weapons of mass destruction cost them their lives. Our brave
men and women in uniform know when they enlist that there is
always the chance they may have to pay the ultimate sacrifice.
Their motives are never -- as we so squalidly claimed in the
wake of the Jessica Lynch affair -- to get a higher education
because the military is now the sole conduit to it for the two-thirds
of Americans who can't afford it. What a despicably mercenary
motive to impute to our heroes! And in any case, why isn't the
re-election of an epochal president a lofty patriotic aim, worth
the sacrifice -- as our great defense secretary has implied --
of a few lives? Why would this aim fill us with rage and hate,
instead of quiet pride?
We were wrong to call George
W. Bush's huge tax cuts legalized looting, wrong about the replacement
of a $5 trillion surplus with a $3 trillion deficit. No, that
is not $8 trillion down the drain in three short years. We arrived
at that ridiculous conclusion by juggling the figures. If you're
as egregiously partisan as we, you can make figures prove anything.
We see that now.
We apologize from the bottom
of our hearts for our unfounded suspicions about the plane crash
that killed Minnesota Sen. Paul Wellstone and his family. Only
a wild-eyed conspiracy nut would link it to the crash had killed
Missouri Gov. Mel Carnahan. Nostra culpa! Grief unhinged our
better judgment. Hey, Democrats die in planes around election
time. That's life. We better get used to it.
What drives us to ask -- so
shrilly, so annoyingly -- why Ken Lay still isn't in prison?
Are we really certain that he deprived hundreds of thousands
of people of their savings? That he helped hatch a plot to bring
down the Democrats in California by destabilizing that state's
power supply? So what if that's now happened? Has Mr. Lay done
anything that is technically wrong?
Realizing now the awesome
power of prayer, we'll stop praying every moment of every day
that Tom DeLay gets snatched up in the rapture. We realize, too,
that the sign in his office -- "This Could Be The Day"
(i.e., Judgment Day) -- does not utterly disqualify Mr. DeLay
from assessing the best long-term interests of the nation. We
believe, with him, that the poor are entirely to blame for their
own poverty, and that if -- sorry, when -- our savior returns,
he will indeed own a concealed-carry permit. We know now that
Mr. DeLay is not precisely the kind of religious lunatic the
Founders had in mind when separating church and state; that he
and his co-religionists are in no way brutish, heathen, hate-driven
humbugs whose fundamentalism makes Osama bin Laden look like
the archbishop of Canterbury. We hope and pray that Mr. DeLay
will guide the destiny of America till the trump of doom. Even
if it is next Tuesday.
Looking back on the decade-plus
of our boundless ill will and partisan fury, we've come to understand
something absolutely vital about that glorious year 1989, the
year you won the Cold War: The reason the Cold War had to be
won was that it made the world a two-party system. One of them
had to go. It's the same in our great nation. What's the point
of having two (or even one and a half) parties when it leads
to nothing but unending conflict, frustration, stagnation and
despair? For America to bring the message to the world that ours
is the best and only way, we must have unanimity. One party indivisible
under God.
Yet ever since 1989, we've
been fighting a new Cold War -- in Congress, in the culture,
in the media, in the nation's schools and courts and bedrooms.
It's time for us to ... surrender.
We're tearing down the Berlin Wall of rage and malice we've erected
between you and us. We do this before it is too late, before
you reach the point where you will be forced -- however reluctantly
-- to investigate us, confiscate our property, search our houses,
seize our personal records, detain us sine die, suspend habeas
corpus, take reprisals against our loved ones, hold show trials,
send us to re-education camps -- whatever you in your impeccable
judgment deem necessary to preserve the homeland from, well,
the likes of us.
But -- a huge "but,"
we know -- if in your great hearts you can find the room to forgive
us, if even the meanest of positions can be found for us in the
new dispensation, let us serve you. We'll do anything you want,
no matter how menial: deleting hard drives, wiretapping journalists,
delivering bags of cash to senators, transporting assets to the
Caymans, firing pregnant Mexicans, evicting the disabled, laying
bets for virtuous windbags, beating up young gay men, escorting
Muslims to the border, performing sexual favors for The Heritage
Foundation -- whatever you need we'll do it, and for free.
Some of us even have advanced
skills to put at your disposal. We could help discredit Europe's
socialistic health and welfare systems and nonprofit public utilities
so The Carlyle Group can privatize them. We could produce inspiring
movies about the great Americans who are ushering in the thousand
years of prosperity that are just around the corner. We could
create upbeat news stories for the Ministry of Truth you plan
for George W. Bush's second term.
We come to you not just as
sinners but as supplicants, begging not just forgiveness but
inclusion. There's a reason God named the right the right: Because
it's right. You have a monopoly on the truth, and you always
have and you always will.
We see that now. We really
do.
...................................................................................................................................
From: holderlin66
Date: Sat Jan 24, 2004 10:42 pm
Subject: Re: Twisted Anthroposophy/boo-hoo
--- In [email protected],
"holderlin66" wrote:
Bradford comments;
I know you only want the best for us and
I think this letter of apology says it all. I hope you take it,
exactly the way it was meant. You certainly don't - couldn't
- wouldn't - have the ugly malice of Racism and subversive accusations
against Steiner, with his immense character flaws, at the heart
of your arguments. I think all of us here recognize your good
intentions. I just want to say that we are humbled in the presence
of such integrity and honesty and the wide spread Michael School
offers this confession of our guilt and our deep admission that
your Cult is much wiser than our Cult.
The Black Magic Cult of Sado Racism dedicates
this song to all those who have suffered under Steiner's whoop
-DEE - DOO cosmic fantasies.
We're so sorry Uncle Albert
We're so sorry if we caused you any pain
We're so sorry Uncle Albert
But there's no one left at home
And I believe i'm gonna rain
We're so sorry but we haven't heard a thing all day
We're so Sorry Uncle Albert
But if anything should happen we'll be sure to give a ring
We're so sorry Uncle Albert
But we haven't done a bloody thing all day
We're so sorry Uncle Albert
But the kettle's on the boil and we're so easily called away
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
Admiral Halsey notified me
He had to have a berth or he couldn't get to sea
I had another look and i had a cup of tea and butter pie
(the butter wouldn't melt so i put it in the pie)
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
Live a little be a gypsy,
get around(get around)
Get your feet up off the ground
Live a little, get around
Live a little be a gypsy, get around(get around)
Get your feet up off the ground
Live a little, get around
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
Hand across the water (water)
Heads across the sky
...................................................................................................................................
From: Tarjei Straume
Date: Sun Jan 25, 2004 6:53 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] Re: Twisted Anthroposophy
At 06:02 25.01.2004, Diana wrote:
My first few weeks in the Waldorf school,
I remember noticing (and setting aside my annoyance) that parents
were not told clearly how Christian the school was. I didn't
know too much of Steiner yet, but I noticed that in the song
the kindergarten children sing,
"Waken, sleeping butterfly,
burst your narrow prison,
Spread your golden wings and fly,
For the sun is risen"
the last line could also be heard, "The
Son is risen," and I thought that was a clever but rather
unfair way (sung right before Easter) to be proselytizing Christianity
to the tiny tots without the parents' full understanding. I had
a lot to learn yet about the symbol of the butterfly and the
sun in anthroposophy! They may as well have been hoping parents
would hear "Son" and not "sun"!
Reminds me of an old Star Trek episode with
William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy and those guys. They'd been
to a planet where there was a lot of strife with spears and swords,
and where some people talked about being inspired by the sun
- well, that's how Captain Kirk and his crew understood it. But
on their way home to the Starfleet base or whatever, Uhura shows
how sometimes women have a keener understanding of spiritual
things than men (something also pointed our by Steiner in connection
with how it was women who discovered that Christ had risen from
the dead). Uhura explains to Kirk that those people weren't talking
about the sun, but the son, the Son of God! Christianity all
over again on a distant planet!
Christ is the God of the Spiritual Sun and
the Emissary of the Sun Beings, the Elohim. It's a peculiarity
of the English language that the Son and the Sun are homonyms;
they are one and the same: The origin and sustainer of our existence.
"In the beginning was
the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The
same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him;
and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him
was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth
in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not." - John 1:1-5
Clever and unfair? Only for those who suffer
from some kind of Christophobia.
I don't know about any dark conspiracies,
and if Sharon knows secrets about dark conspiracies, she's keeping
them from me :) My angle is similar to Sharon's which is mainly
that Waldorf schools should be open about their esoteric base.
I remember Sharon's WC posts were about sinister
secrets in Anthroposophy that went bumb in the night. I'll get
back to it if I can.
Cheers,
Tarjei
http://uncletaz.com/
...................................................................................................................................
From: b m bryanmiller
Date: Sun Jan 25, 2004 8:34 am
Subject: Re: [anthroposophy_tomorrow] To Diana
Diana
At some point here you said something about trying to leave.
If you mean leaving the group, I hope you don't do it. I like
your e-mails. And not only because you made a reference to Bart
Simpson, eh. You are a sensible and good person, and it's interesting
and fun to read what you write. Thanks for being open to a civilized
dialogue.
Bryan
winters_diana wrote:
Hi guys, whew, so much to reply to. And
it's hard for me, since Ihave to wait for Peter Staudenmaier
to tell me what to say :)
...................................................................................................................................
From: golden3000997
Date: Tue Jan 27, 2004 7:38 pm
Subject: To Diana
Diana,
Like 98.7% of people in this world, you don't
have a clue what the word "science" really means. Above
all, scientific methodology requires holding any thesis "with
a light hand." Being open minded and willing to examine
and acknowledge incoming data (my terminology.) You have proven
yourself far from being a scientific person. As with the masses
today, Science for you is the new Superstition or Religion.
To people who think like you do, men in white
lab coats with clipboards have become a substitute archetype
for men in black cassocks with rosaries. People speak about Science
as they used to speak about God. And they are as little willing
to work at understanding Science as people have been reluctant
to truly seek God for themselves. How many people who play the
"Science Says" game have looked into an electron microscope,
or understand how fractals are created, or have sat up night
after endless night gazing through an observatory telescope,
seeking for a tiny blip that could mean the existence of a previously
unknown planet or even solar system? I have not
done these things myself, but I know that if I ever wanted to
speak about Science with any real insight, I would have to have some of this type of experiential (epistomological??)
knowledge to start with.
More than half of the ideas, theories and
conclusions that the population considers as "real"
and validated by Science will be repudiated by Science itself
within a few years at the most. There have been libraries of
information once regarded as "scientific fact" that
would now appear laughable. But most people do not consider this
and say, "Science is constantly contradicting itself, finding
its own conclusions wrong and often substituting 180 degree opposite
views faster than a spinning top. Therefore, Science is not to
be trusted. Science cannot give us a true perception of the world,
its origins and process of development. If it could, it would
always be right." No, people do not say this. They say,
"Science (meaning the cataloging and classification of natural
phenomenon) is the ONLY line of true inquiry. Science is the
ONLY means of establishing truth. Science by (common) definition
deals ONLY with materially measurable phenomena and therefore
there cannot be any Scientific fact to be discovered outside
of this materially measurable phenomena. If Science contradicts
its own findings, that is all the more proof of its committment
to truth and the fundamental reason why we should trust it implicitly.
Science may not have ALL of the answers. But only Scientific
answers can have any possible value. THEREFORE, we will believe
ONLY Scientists and those who support their work implicitly."
Never mind that Rudolf Steiner WAS a scientist
of the material, measurable world. Never mind that he held a
PhD in Natural Science. (Where do people think he got that from,
a Crackerjacks box?) Never mind that most of what Rudolf Steiner
gave insight into can be supported by rational, everyday thinking
and that over the past century, much of his "theory"
has come to be supported more and more by "mainstream"
scientific research. Never mind that the insights that Rudolf
Steiner provided in almost every field of endeavor have been
able to be applied with beneficial and reproducable results.
Farming, Medicine, Architecture, Physiological Research, Education,
Curative Education have produced quantifiable results by putting
his "theories" into practice. Music, Speech, Plastic
Arts, Movement Arts, Drama and Theology are not generally accepted
as "Scientific" endeavors, and yet, more and more mainstream
Science thinkers are writing about and discussing the interconnectivity
of Science with fields that used to belong exclusively to "Art"
and/ or "Religion."
I started looking up "left handed"
on the internet last night. There is a new book called "Right
Hand, Left Hand" by Chris MacManus
http://www.righthandlefthand.com/
It looks very interesting. I started following
links and got to the American Federation Teachers and there was
not one article on lefthandedness (but plenty on their salaries).
There are other websites that look very good. Of course, there
are many "horror" stories of lefties and happened when
teachers and parents tried to switch them. Of course, anyone
who uses barbaric methods to force change in a child (for anything!)
should be criticized and stopped. But, I am
wondering if there could be a study of people who were switched
as children who did NOT experience any bad reactions, learning
difficulties or emotional traumas and who might say as teens
or adults that they were happy that they were switched, if for
no other reason than that it is a more convenient world for right-handers.
It is easy to focus on the mistakes of any system of thought
or action and to neglect the balancing experiences. Why not criticize
Catholic schools for centuries of horror stories? How about fundamentalist
Christian Schools? Boy, look at the websites and language there!
I wouldn't want to be left handed in a Christian school, no way!
But I agree totally and whole heartedly that
Catholics and Christian fundamentalists should have their own
schools and not be in control of any Public school. And I agree
also that no parent should put their child in a Waldorf School
without having as much information as possible presented beforehand.
After making the choice, I don't think that any parent should
accept what a teacher says "on faith." There has to
be constant communication. Waldorf teachers do have to study
and keep abreast of current educational and developmental ideas
and be prepared to factor them into the equation. Parents' concerns
and criticisms should be taken seriously and addressed. But there
also has to be some trust involved on the part of the parents
that the school and its teachers are doing there very best to
know and understand each child as an individual. A parent who
constantly invades the classroom in a hostile way and becomes
disruptive yet refuses to study the very available literature
and attend the lectures and workshops (given by every Waldorf
school I have ever known), this kind of parent does not belong
in the school. Not because he or she is asking questions!
But because he or she is not IN TRUTH seeking
answers. Waldorf schools do have a working theory, a recognizable
form and methodology. An individual parent cannot mold a whole
school to suit his or her personal preferences. There is much
room for communication and compromise. There is in most cases
a spirit of compassion and real concern for both the individual
child and the family unit. But there is also a great deal of
committment on the part of Waldorf Schools and Waldorf Teachers
to the unique view of the world, the development of the human
being and the Spirit of Anthroposophy that Waldorf Schools are
but one expression of. This Spirit of Anthroposophy is NOT occult.
It has taken (and continues to take) many things that have been
specifically Occult throughout the history
of civilization and brings them to light. It continually seeks
to uncover the occult, or hidden secrets of human evolution and
bring them out into the open. It rejects
whole heartedly the dominant theory found throughout Western
Civilization that the best knowledge and the best fruits of knowledge
should belong to an exclusive, priveleged few. It seeks to donate
freely, without proselytizing, the open secrets of the human
being, the material world and the spiritual world to all who
ask and are willing to listen with open ears, look with open
eyes and feel with open hearts.
Without Openess of Heart, Mind and Experience
no one can become a Waldorf Teacher. Anyone attempting to go
through a teacher training program who expects to be "spoon
fed" materials and methods is sure to come in for a real
shock. You couldn't pre-package Waldorf Education if you wanted
to! It has NO shelf life.
At the same time, it is hard to "sell"
Waldorf Education to many parents because they expect "instant
iced tea" answers to their questions - sound bytes that
they can feel comfortable with. Politically correct phrases that
sound really good at dinner parties. These kinds of inquiring
parents usually do not choose to put their child in a Waldorf
School. And if they do, they are often "disillusioned"
with the experience because they have had so many of their preconceptions
about their own child, education in general and even themselves
strongly challenged.
A good Waldorf Teacher, like a good teacher
in any kind of school welcomes a concerned, questioning parent
because he or she knows that a good, intellectually and/ or artistically
stimulating relationship between a teacher and a parent is vital
to the process of uncovering the "riddle of the child"
who they both love. On the other hand, a teacher's day is hectic
and filled to the brim and there does not always seem to be enough
time and space to explore all of each parent's questions in the
depth that they deserve. That is why we often recommend books
and are grateful when people put out good articles and literature.
We give them to parents hoping that they will be able to see
some of the answers for themselves. It is really too bad when
there isn't enough follow-through, though and a parent feels
slighted. This does happen. The best thing is a school where
there are "experienced" parents who make themselves
available to incoming families as mentors and thus assist the
parents to understand the teachers better and vice versa. It
is the hope of every developing school community that this will
come about. But it can't be forced. It has to come from each
community's own sense of itself. Some, I am sure are better at
it than others.
At the end of the day, there will be some
failures. There will also be successes. We may never even know
which it is that we have brought about. Some things will only
become apparent years down the road. Many things a teacher may
do "right" he or she will never really know. Our children
are not laboratory rats and we only have a one time shot, we
can never duplicate a day or an hour or even a minute of our
experience with them. The results of our "experiments"
cannot be fed into a computer and statistically analyzed. Yes,
there is more of Alchemy than "Science" at work in
a Waldorf classroom, because we have to take the best that we
have inside us of Science, Art and Religion and create each day
something totally unique and extraordinary. We are Symphony Conductors.
We do our best to study theory, to practice technique and to
try to understand how to pull together an orchestra of disparate
tonalities. But all that is just preparation, for the Song that
arises from the souls of the children is more than we could ever
have imagined before it is sung.
Speaking personally, if I didn't have some
kind of "faith" in the existence of beings greater
in wisdom than I am - some physical, some not - I could not feel
adequate to such an undertaking. My faults and weaknesses are
all too apparent. But as a Waldorf Teacher, I "believe"
because of the experiences that I have had so far in this lifetime,
that all of us are more than we "appear" and that there
will be a myriad of miracles in which we do or say the right
thing at the right time in spite of ourselves.
This is a prayer poem which I found a long
time ago. It is not from Rudolf Steiner, but it still expresses
so much of what I have felt every day in front of a room full
of children.
I share it with you in good faith.
Christine
A Teacher's Prayer
"Lord, who am I to teach
the way
to little children day by day,
so prone myself to go astray?
I teach them knowledge, but
I know
how faint the flicker and how low
the candle of my knowledge glows.
I teach them power to will
and do
but only now to learn anew,
my own great weakness through and through.
I teach them love for all
mankind
and all God's creatures, but I find
my love comes lagging far behind.
Lord, if their guide I still
must be,
O let the little children see
the teacher leaning hard on thee."
Author Unknown
...................................................................................................................................
From: holderlin66
Date: Wed Jan 28, 2004 12:31 pm
Subject: Martians and Herman Hess
--- In [email protected],
golden3000997 wrote:
At the end of the day, there will be some
failures. There will also be successes. We may never even know
which it is that we have brought about. Some things will only
become apparent years down the road. Many things a teacher may
do "right" he or she will never really know. Our children
are not laboratory rats and we only have a one time shot, we
can never duplicate a day or an hour or even a minute of our
experience with them. The results of our "experiments"
cannot be fed into a computer and statistically analyzed. Yes,
there is more of Alchemy than "Science" at work in
a Waldorf classroom, because we have to take the best that we
have inside us of Science, Art and Religion and create each day
something totally unique and extraordinary. We are Symphony Conductors.
We do our best to study theory, to practice technique and to
try to understand how to pull together an orchestra of disparate
tonalities. But all that is just preparation, for the Song that
arises from the souls of the children is more than we could ever
have imagined before it is sung.
Speaking personally, if I didn't have some
kind of "faith" in the existence of beings greater
in wisdom than I am - some physical, some not - I could not feel
adequate to such an undertaking. My faults and weaknesses are
all too apparent. But as a Waldorf Teacher, I "believe"
because of the experiences that I have had so far in this lifetime,
that all of us are more than we "appear" and that there
will be a myriad of miracles in which we do or say the right
thing at the right time in spite of ourselves.
This is a prayer poem which I found a long
time ago. It is not from Rudolf Steiner, but it still expresses
so much of what I have felt every day in front of a room full
of children.
I share it with you in good faith.
Christine
A Teacher's Prayer
"Lord, who am I to
teach the way
to little children day by day,
so prone myself to go astray?
I teach them knowledge,
but I know
how faint the flicker and how low
the candle of my knowledge glows.
I teach them power to will
and do
but only now to learn anew,
my own great weakness through and through.
I teach them love for all
mankind
and all God's creatures, but I find
my love comes lagging far behind.
Lord, if their guide I
still must be,
O let the little children see
the teacher leaning hard on thee."
Author Unknown
Bradford comments;
Dear Christine; Ah, Ah, this is what you get
paid the big bucks for. This particular phrasing, really earned
you your salary for the week. This is exactly the unique pearls
of thought that are so lost and bent by a culture that doesn't
grasp the heart and the mind.
Yes, there is more of Alchemy than "Science"
at work in a Waldorf classroom, because we have to take the best
that we have inside us of Science, Art and Religion and create
each day something totally unique and extraordinary. We are Symphony
Conductors. We do our best to study theory, to practice technique
and to try to understand how to pull together an orchestra of
disparate tonalities. But all that is just preparation, for the
Song that arises from the souls of the children is more than
we could ever have imagined before it is sung.
Further:
Yes, offering freely, the wide open vistas
of science, art, religion and education in a startling new inflow,
influx that saturates startles the dry skin and cracked veins
and withered skin of science is part of the generosity an etheric
influx of Spiritual Science.
Human growth and growing towards ones own
higher developemnt presupposes that there is a higher development.
It presupposes that some of what ancient thinkers as well as
standard human development manuals tell us about growing towards
wisdom, self-knowledge, heck Herman Hess...and yes I loved "The
Glass Bead Game", Christine.
Albert Steffen and Herman Hesse were struggling
with inside issues and outside issues. They knew each other and
Steffen had certainly disappeared into the Glass Bead Game. In
any case, the world is such an interesting place with the addition
of Spiritual Science. It is even more interesting in that our
natural scientific curiosity, I mean Sciences, any science, Stephen
Hawking Science, or Einstein and Oppenheimer Science, is all
the more interesting and sparks our curiosity all the more because
of Spiritual Science. Where are the barriers to a Child's curiosity?
Are the riddles of the universe connected intimately with human
beings? Science thinks so and so does Spiritual Science. Physics
has encountered this mystery and Spiritual Science has advanced
deep into the territory.
You are right Christine. Most teachers have
not had that natural curiosity drummed out of them. We look at
the heart of the child, we measure the life biography and the
riddles awaiting them, and we see the high ideal they bring with
them and the long road ahead. The Child needs all the wonder
in its gas tank it can get. Learning is clearly an alchemical
process, not an input-output mechanism.
"Stranger in a Strange Land" was
pointed out to me a few years back by JoAnn. It obviously eluded
me during my common experiences of "Hair" and my own
very specific development through the 60's and 70's. This was
a good thing for me.
In the meantime I gradually made my way to
Buddha and St. Francis and had the time to richly digest Steiner
insights. So, there in the wonders of the Mars Sphere, Siddhartha
and Herman Hess brought to an entire generation a review of Buddhism
and the destiny of Buddha, all the way up to our friend Keanu
Reeves. Where Buddhists, Dali Lama's, IMO, clumisly search for
the reincarnated instant loop, incarnated leader. Here again,
the Dali Lama and the East could stand some Spiritual Science
and some higher common sense. I would say that for the Pope as
well as Dali Lama's and this is sound common sense.
But adjusting my gaze to the fact that I saw,
or we thought we saw, those few people Walk on the Moon, while
Star Trek presented a Mars Culture in Warf and a Kubrick 2001
quest for the immortal soul of man, the thread in our Dylan Generation
culture, could lead to the understanding of how Mars insights
were sent back to us transformed in Ganhi/MLK Jr./Thoreau and
hundreds of thousands of others currently running common sense
in their soul life.
Troubadours and from the 12th and 13th century,
icy Scholastic Nominalism and indeed, my sense that many have
incarnated out of the French Revolution and Rousseau even from
WWI have carried with them a mighty spiritual change in the Mars
Forces. What are these Mars forces?
Ah- as one sees a sunset, A vowel that fully
instinctively expresses, as getting into a warm tub of water...
INNER VENUS
O - as when an Oh, a child gets hurt and we
ring them round with a protective OH. Is an INNER JUPITER experience.
UH - as our elemental experience when someone
comes from behind us, and puts a cold hand or ice water down
our backs.
A or E - Is a particular Space defining gesture
we make instinctively when in NEW YORK, we say Hey, Hey, Hey..which
is the standard space defining and space antipathy VOWEL of MARS.
WE MEET WITH AN INNER MARS EXPERIENCE.
Revolving through the constellations
VENUS intones the green wonder of beauty,
Mercury the golden joy of movement,
MARS is a red fire of action,
JUPITER a flame of enfolding love,
SATURN, a blue depth of reverence,
And the MOON, a motion come to violet stillness.
What a holy dance is this
As planets encircle the all-sustaining Sun!
Bradford concludes;
Instinct and the elemental aspect of the Vowels,
reveal an inner planetary mood that is carried in the stream
of how we unconsciously use langauge and the Vowels in our daily
lives. Elemental Beings live in those imbued intonations. Especially
when you hear raw exclamations and sudden, unrehersed blurts.
Aspects of a Teacher's life, find that word tone and symphonic
intonation, and the natural unfolding of the child, reveals these
vowels as intrinsic and intimate to the expression of the soul
life. Just details but containing a Rainbow of Newtonian mood.
This is science, the same science Waldorf uses in water color
painting.
Naturally, most of us who have given any significant
thought to Spiritual Science, are not expecting to see our Dead
in their migration path through the planets, to be romping around
for the cameras currently on Mars. Some of you may want to read
that sentence again. There is even a silly Carpenter movie called,
"The Ghosts of Mars". But where Beethoven snatched
his music; Where Shakespeare interviewed and saw his Characters
in their Devachan destiny..or Rainer Marie Rilke, reaching for
Angels, these are included in the vast treasure house of the
research of Science and the HUman Being.
Feeling=Thinking=Willing...as they appear
in the construction of the Speech Organism in the human being,
means that Science of the universe and Man is an interconnected,
layered, lazured, textured experience that passes through many
layers of the soul life to bring conviction to the soul. Lips,
Teeth, and Palate, are the actual elemental regions of life.
OUr lips kiss and in soft whispers we express our love, in sharp
dissonance we hiss our teethy antipathy and in grand Lord of
the Rings, Gandalfian speech, akin to Home, we use the palate
or Will forces.. Yes we break it down to the fact that the Heart
and the lips is how we meet the world in education. But do we
follow such an obvious cosmic plan as educators? We deny that
the human being is this entire expression of Science. WE are
the facts not what floundering Science imagines as a full or
empty glass. Blessed are they that are not so stubborn as to
need constant near death experiences or dysfunctional trailer
park mood swings to feel and comprehend mysteries when they are
openly explained to us warmly and openly.
So these layers of denial, dysfunction, prejudice
and early childhood parental dogma fix, determine and lock down
very rigid fields in the invisible world where Science cannot
seem to hold itself up to the test of true Science. For indeed
it has been proven that the experiment can not separated from
the Scientist who experments and in particualr in measuring atoms
in opposite regions where they should not appear but do.
But where does Pauline maturity come from?
It is fine in the sandbox of atomic theory, but on a greater
scaffolding and meaning is the layered maturity of the Soul and
Spirit Being of humans. There lies the Science. There is where
we come to the HOW - The WHY and the WHAT, let alone the WHEN...When
Christ took hold of Matter through the vast scaffolding of wisdom
in the human soul. Where does sandbox science stand? On a sandbox/Soapbox
and imagines that the human being itself isn't the highest instrument
of Science. That someone could have observed their will forces
while using the left and right hand and honestly reviewed whether
it drew on the lower organism of the will or the upper incarnational
Seed incased in the Bone of the skull and known as the brain.
Such a book as "A WILL TO POWER"
or determining if digestive problems would arise through drawing
off the organism instead of the brain and if there was an alternative
bio-energetic field shift to compensate for something that the
soul brought with it as a fail safe..Could digestive problems
arise from bad education? Could sclerosis, hardening of the bones
and drying out of the etheric forces arise through too much abstract
intellectual memorization?
Or, let us try to understand the whole Cyclops
basis of OnE EYe and Odhin's ONE EYe and why he plucked out his
One Eye and traded it, and the Christ statement, "lest thine
eye be single". It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see
how the human being is dual, split, left side right side, two
eyes, two ears, two legs, two nostrils, two halves of a brain
are a series of checks and balances, that are specific to incarnating
through the MOON region into the Cell splitting and Sex dividing
region that the Earth and matter region are known for. Oops did
no one tell science about the Reproductive portal and the Lunar
mysteries? Makes ya wanna go out and howl.
I have traced this reproductive lunar split
to not only the Axis of the Earth itself and how it sits in space
in relation to the Sun but how the 46 degree angle to Vega and
the North star reflect the 23 and 46 chromosome split of the
cell division. 23 and the Tropic of Cancer and Capricorn and
the Cell are linked clues. Cell division itself is a unique dual
signature of incarnation of all species from plants, to humans..
THis biological divider is clearly placed within the context
of understanding the Moon's influence on Females as well as how
the endocrine system functions.
We come back to integration, penetration and
each individual, not some edifice called SCIENCE standing over
the human soul. The Human being is Science. He/She is a built
in superstructure of Science of the Gods. I mentioned awhile
back that Reincarnation was an Invention of the Gods to transplant
Time Beings into Future forms. We go in and out of Time and are
Transplanted, with our faculties into future Times, intact. Better
than "Beam Me Aboard".
Christine was Right, as rain when she described
the church of science replacing the dogmatic creed of faith.
We know that a 500 year pivot has allowed Ahrimanic Science to
replace Luciferic Faith in the Church and the same karmic errors
that had to do with Luciferic belief in the dogmas of the Church,
come right back to haunting the soul in the Ahrimanic dogmas
of Science today. That is indeed how the karma of one calls forth
the karma of the other. But until souls feel like they can journey
on a true science adventure with mankind, part of their unholy
war is aimed at subjective issues that really are projected onto
everyone else.
I mean that everyone else, currently half
those that oppose the Bush Administration as liars and can ask
for real proof for their deceptions, have a healthy sense of
Common Sense. That is a lot of people. IN the mix are those that
fall into Right or Left Wing blind support. But as we go deeper
and deeper into the objectivity of the soul, we come to core
issues that only Spiritual Science and human development can
answer. It is a form of holy Alchemy.
We learn, thank goodness, slowly. However
we will fight to the death and send everyone into nuclear terror
to convince ourselves of the authority of the new church of Science
that replaced the Church dogmas. That is why the Bush Yellow
Cake and 16 Words have awakened the world to a flaw in the psychology
of American Goodness. It is a glaring flaw and the World outside
of America has the good sense to see it. But that did not stop
those who brought up children in this world to build a case for
having their children killed in Iraq for the booty of liars.
Let alone the thousands of Dead Iraqis. In the 20th century,
about 100,000,000 people were brutally, barbacially murdered.
For exactly what?
Down deep we trace these things back in Time
and we connect to Beings, Michael-Christ-Ahriman our Angels..and
you know what, we even connect spans of the history of the church
and the tableau of humanity and it is correct to expand the search
for WMD into the depths of the human soul.. For indeed the region
where WMD lie are in the twisted foundations of the human soul.
But those with Common Sense do not get into a John Ashcroft witchhunt
or a Rush Limbaugh hatred group, that logically have to deny
the very Christ and St. Paul event to exist. Liberal or Lefties
or REAlists from ancient times, or anyone with common sense realize
how difficult it is to penetrate layer upon layer of the human
soul and thinking, feeling and willing forces to glimpse sound
Truth. When we penetrate these areas we discover vast stockpiles
of WMD of our own making.
Bradford
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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